Torchwood: Kiss, Kiss, Bang, Bang...

[fajrdrako]

Well. I'd watched the trailers. I'd seen the clips. I'd read the interviews. And it was still better than I expected.

The highlight of the show was James Marsters as Captain John Hart, who, for all his advance publicity, was more outrageously entertaining than I'd imagined he could be. (Was Spike that good on Buffy?) In fact, all the relationships were fun - with interesting twists every which way.

I'm tempted to list one good line after another. I think the winner may be Captain John's "Five minutes to live, you want me to behave?" but I might have to listen a few more times to make the final choice of bon mot du jour.

Things I liked:

1. That the Torchwood team seems to have improved both their mastery of their technology and their manner of using it, though they don't seem a lot smarter than they were. Was I the only one shouting, "Gwen, don't turn your back on him?" when Gwen was with Captain John? And when she turned her back on him? ....But they do seem more competent, and I appreciate that. The episode's plot did not happen because they screwed up. I'd have been happier if Ianto hadn't failed to shoot the Blowfish.

2. Jack said, "I found my Doctor." With the sweetest smile. I melted. And: "I came back for you. All of you." Perfect. I loved all the references to this relationship with the Doctor, the Torchwood team (singly and together), to his time away from them, and their reactions. Especially Ianto, who fears - I would guess - that he'll have his heart broken again. How long was Jack gone from Torchwood? I couldn't tell.

3. Every reference to the Time Agency. And to Jack's past, with or without Captain John. Lots of good stuff, and more sense of how Jack feels about it, compared to his present. Grey? Oooh, Chibnall, you got me with that one. (Is Grey Jack's child?)

4. The omnisexuality. The flirting, the jokes, the kissing, the touching. What a contrast from last season! Not just bisexuality and an orgy reference - has Chibnall been reading our fanfic online? - but office fetishes and poodle-lust. My goodness.

5. Captain John Hart: Just the right combinations of funny, dangerous, outrageous, sexual, tricky and immoral. And I love his costume. Loved him clearing out the bar. Loved the whole flirtation/fighting with Captain Jack. Loved the mixed message of his bittersweet broken love for Jack and his callous revenges. (Lost his soul, and misses it.) Loved it that at the end he understood enough to want to join the team and stay with Jack.

6. Captain Jack: Fitting more into the ensemble group than before, but with some outstanding solo moments. "These people. This planet. All the beauty you can never see. That's what I came back for." Harkens back to his first speech in "Everything Changes": "I love this planet." He really does.

7. Gwen: Clearly miffed with Jack for leaving and not for confiding in them. Interesting scene where he said he came back "for you". Are we supposed to take the "all of you" for granted there? The ambiguity was interesting. And then the revelation of her engagement to Rhys. Loved that, and her phone conversation with Rhys. But I had the feeling that she's not as comfortable with the overall situation as she pretends: her love for Rhys seems tinged with condescension. Most obvious famous last words I've heard in a long time¹: "I can handle this." I loved, absolutely loved, her willingness to sacrifice herself to save Cardiff. This is why I love Gwen.

8. Owen: Do we believe him, that he's through chasing after women, looking for someone he has something in common with? Was he angling after Tosh there, or being oblivious? He did seem, in general, less annoying and more human than we've seen him in the past: I live in hope. But not, I hastily add, hope for a relationship between him and Tosh.

9. Toshiko: Perhaps the least changed, but I liked it that her intelligence and ingenuity was played up.

10. Ianto: Just about perfect. I haven't enjoyed him this much since "Cyberwoman". The pink and red shirts, the bits of action, the wariness with Jack, the glee with which he timed Captain John's incipient death with the stopwatch - oooh, I love a jealous Ianto. Dangerous! And I usually don't like jealousy as a theme, but this works perfectly, with a twitch of the eyebrow. Loved his scene with Captain John, too, when the Captain forced him into the elevator. Also the 'date' conversation between Ianto and Jack: "Is that a yes?" And Ianto's defensive, "Yes." His manner was just right through all of that: I have seldom been so impressed with Gareth David-Lloyd's acting. I wonder if we'll get to see their date. I wonder what movie they'd pick to see.

11. Nice moment when the team and then Jack came back to the hub to capture Captain John - all acting like a team. Solidarity rules! At last!

12. Jack taught John the lip-gloss trick? We thought it was Saffron.

13. Loved the theme of the beauty Jack finds on Earth, and John's difficulty in seeing it.

Good lines:

• "Bloody Torchwood."


• "This fish is wired." Also loved the way this tied into Captain John's arrival and the theme of his substance abuse.


• "I was hoping for a little power struggle, resolved by some naked wrestling."


• "This is one of your spooky-dooes, is it?"


• "What can you be doing that's more important than me?"


• "You were the wife!" "I was a good wife."


• "Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi."


• "What is this, sewer chic?"


• "Has he got to the 'no kissing' rule yet? He just invented that because wants me all to himself."
  
• "Your dolly-birds did all my work."


• "See you in hell." I loved that back on series 1 Doctor Who, too.


• "Rehab. Didn't really work."


• "Eye candy."


• "You are unbelievable." "And yet you still find me strangely attractive."


• "What about a last-minute rescue? What's the point of being on a team if you don't get a last-minute rescue?"


• "Temporal displacement. Makes your tongue tingle."


• "Remind me never to get on your bad side."


• "Definitely bigger."


• "That's a poodle."

I'd say, all in all, this is the second-best episode of Torchwood to date, second only to "Captain Jack Harkness".

~ ~ ~

¹ Well, actually, since three weeks ago, when the Doctor said to Astrid, "I will save you. I promise" in Voyage of the Damned. So not really all that long.

Comments

[goss.livejournal.com]

EEEEEE!!!! I just watched it. Wow. Everything you said! Captain John was perfect. So many sexual/slashy bits I don't even know where to start. It has been a long time since a show has made me want to BURST WITH *GLEE*.

*beam*

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

BURST WITH *GLEE*

Oh my goodness yes. "Gleeful" just about covers it. What a lovely, funny, smart, sexy show. I am thrilled. Still on a high from seeing it. Gotta watch it again tomorrow!

[darthhellokitty.livejournal.com]

That was great, wasn't it? XD

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Such fun! Such sexiness! Such Captaincy!

[chili-dance.livejournal.com]

I downloaded this episode with a handful of salt, since the one episode of s1 Torchwood I saw didn't really impress me that much, and a lot of what I was hearing about it was basically 'everyone wants to have sex. And Jack angsts in every episode,' so I was really turned off on it. But when you linked to previews of this one, I thought, 'what the hell,' especially since Martha's going to be in it later.

And now I think: wooooooow! Man, this was a really good episode. So I guess I'm going to have to go back and give s1 a better try. Thank you for giving me a nudge! (Even though you didn't know, heh.)

Best line was the Star Wars one, hands down~

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

since the one episode of s1 Torchwood I saw didn't really impress me that much

Yes. Series 1 was strange. Not well written, on the whole, though it had brilliant moments; that, and my love of the characters (especially Jack) pulled me through. That, and the Doctor Who connection. Besides which I love the show and the idea of the show with a totally irrational fannish love. But I don't think series 1 was particularly good, it was mixed - sometimes great, sometimes terrible, sometimes various stages in between. There were episodes I thought were unquestionably good - "Captain Jack Harkness", "Out of Time" (though that's not a good one if you don't want to see Jack angst!), "Combat". But fans don't even agree about which were the good episodes, or what was good at them. Lots of fans hate "Cyberwoman", which is one of my favourites. (I guess I like Ianto-angst.)

I really look forward to Martha's appearance!

And yes, "Kiss, Kiss, Bang, Bang" was really good, and good on so many levels that it really does lead me to believe that they've rectified some of the problems (like rushed writing) that persisted through series 1.

Loved the Star Wars line.

[cyberducks.livejournal.com]

It was a great season opener!

that's a beautiful header for your lj...

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

It was a great season opener!

And I hope for more of the same. Quality, I mean.

that's a beautiful header for your lj...

Provided by isagel. Isn't it gorgeous?

[beck-liz.livejournal.com]

(Was Spike that good on Buffy?)

As with most things in fandom, it depends on who you ask. :-) I'd say yes; others would disagree and say that he was good in the early seasons, not so much later on, etc. *shrug* I do think the actor has improved with age, but he was still good back then.

But they do seem more competent, and I appreciate that. The episode's plot did not happen because they screwed up.

Yay! For once the disaster of the episode didn't happen because one of the team messed up! Whoo!

What a contrast from last season!

Dude, who knew we'd be getting this much? Wow.

I loved, absolutely loved, her willingness to sacrifice herself to save Cardiff. This is why I love Gwen.

Yes, yes, and yes. Loved that.

Nice moment when the team and then Jack came back to the hub to capture Captain John - all acting like a team.

Yay, team! Loved that. Especially loved the surprise punch for John of Jack's resurrection. Hee.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

As with most things in fandom, it depends on who you ask

I love fandom: the place where no one can agree on anything, but we all love it anyway.

For once the disaster of the episode didn't happen because one of the team messed up!

Long may that continue!

who knew we'd be getting this much?

I didn't dare to hope.

Especially loved the surprise punch for John of Jack's resurrection. Hee.

I think Jack enjoyed that, too. He had a trump card John didn't even know about.

[wijsgeer.livejournal.com]

Ooh, a captain John cross ship with Saffron is scaring me to death!!

marvelous fun :-)

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

a captain John cross ship with Saffron is scaring me to death!!

Terrifying, isn't it?

They're so alike, now I think of it. Though as far as we know Saffron isn't into poisonous amounts of drugs and alcohol. But still.

Captain Jack and Mal would make a great opposing team, though.

(I wander away smiling as I muse on the thought.)

[janne-d.livejournal.com]

Yup, Spike was that good on Buffy. He was probably my favourite character. This comment: Just the right combinations of funny, dangerous, outrageous, sexual, tricky and immoral
could just as easily be applied to Spike, really. There are whole huge academic articles in Slayage about Spike's gender-coding as well.

I loved it all. Apart from the little weird moment between Jack and Gwen in the tunnel, which I still can't quite get my head around.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Spike was that good on Buffy

I must (and will) watch that show. Just as soon as possible. If Marsters is reprising his best role, I'm all for it.

There are whole huge academic articles in Slayage about Spike's gender-coding as well.

Love it! ("I was a good wife." Hee.)

Apart from the little weird moment between Jack and Gwen in the tunnel, which I still can't quite get my head around.

I liked it (because I like Jack/Gwen stuff) but I found it totally perplexing and didn't know what to make of it. It was before Jack asked Ianto for a date, wasn't it? I don't remember. I have always believed that Jack would like to have an affair with Gwen but doesn't want to mess with her relationship with Rhys - I enjoy the hints of UST. Equally, Gwen wants Jack - but can't justify it, especially after having had an affair with Owen.

Jack let the engagement to Rhys totally deflect him, even though she almost came out and said, "I'd rather have you, if you give me a chance." So was Jack hoping to have both Ianto and Gwen as lovers? Or was he just acting on impulse?

And though I'm all for the Jack/Doctor (by far my favourite pairing), or Jack/Ianto, or Jack/John, or Jack/whoever, I like the reminder (speaking in terms of gender politics) that Jack is bisexual not homosexual and that he is not indifferent to women. I don't want him pegged as "the gay action hero" - a new stereotype. Better than the old ones, I suppose, but still a stereotype.

Am I rambling?

Just enjoying myself way too much.

[toraks.livejournal.com]

Interesting discussion.

I watched it. I really loved some bits (help me obi-wan, you are my only hope) but actually wasn't too impressed overall.

Coming into it, knowing nothing about the characters or their interactions, it didn't really hold my interest all that much. But then action sequences aren't really my thing.

I loved the john jack scene when they first met -- one of the reasons (other than you and kiki) for deciding to watch it was the commentary on BBC Radio 1 yesterday and John Barroman's comment to them along the lines that we was allowed to do a lot more in this show than ever before.

But I think the number of characters (hard time getting them all in my head) and Jack being very cocky made it hard to get into.

overall it was fun, but not necessarily compelling

like John in it though

he was great as Spike, and actually, this character is a lot like Spike's in Buffy, which threw me off a bit actually

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Coming into it, knowing nothing about the characters or their interactions, it didn't really hold my interest all that much.

I can hardly imagine doing that, since so much of the storyline was sheer shippy stuff. Especially Jack's relationship with the team, both singly and together - sometimes edgy, sometimes warm - it's all fairly complicated now. There's a lot of story background, depending on various interactions in their past history. And the action sequences - well, I liked them because of who they were, but that wasn't exactly my focus. The amusing bits entwined in the ation (mostly character interaction) wouldn't make sense either if you didn't know the characters.

I loved the john jack scene when they first met

That was fun. Really set the tone - on numerous contradictory levels.

John Barroman's comment to them along the lines that we was allowed to do a lot more in this show than ever before.

I like that.


I think the number of characters (hard time getting them all in my head) and Jack being very cocky made it hard to get into.

Yes. We've had a season to get to know them. Jack was cocky in Doctor Who (series 1) and then not cocky in Torchwood series 1 - they've reverted to something closer to the original Jack, not the depressed and comparatively withdrawn Jack of series 1. I like his cockiness but it's best when tempered with scenes of his seriousness and his caring - which are the best of all. What I love most about Jack is that he is so very loving. Which maybe didn't show a lot on this episode, which was all about the edginess of his relationship with Captain John, and the difficulties now in his relationship with Ianto - since he'd pretty much abandoned Ianto at the end of last season, for the sake of the Doctor. He abandoned them all without a word, but it gets the most personal significance for Ianto, who was already his lover at the time. So Ianto is now defensive and crusty, doesn't know where he stands (if anywhere).

As for the relationship between Jack and Gwen - I wouldn't even try to explain that.

this character is a lot like Spike's in Buffy, which threw me off a bit actually

Do you mean, you didn't like it because the show copied Spike, or you were just surprised? I barely saw Buffy (though I do plan to watch it at the next opportunity) but my recollection of the bits and pieces I did see is that Spike was the best thing about the show. And I liked Captain John better than Spike because he was a human, not a vampire. I'm not big on vampires. Also because I think he has a wonderful costume.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Yes!!!! Wasn't it fabulous?! The writing seemed a lot sharper, wittier, punchier; the team seems to have matured and grown up (coping without Jack?); Jack isn't depressed any more; John is terrific fun; and... I want more car-driving fish. It's freaky and funny. (Loved the sushi joke when it was lying dead in the Hub.) The poodle line was brilliant, too. Are all time agents so versatile?! (I'm reminded of Jack chatting up everything and every species, including poor Chan, the blue insect-girl, in Utopia.)

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

The writing seemed a lot sharper, wittier, punchier

It certainly did! I'd liked some of Chibnall's scripts before (well, I liked "Cyberwoman". I thught "End of Days" was a mess, despite great moments.)

I guess coping without Jack was good for them, but I'm not sure I like that idea. As Ianto said - it's more fun with him around.

I want more car-driving fish.

Hee - yes! Loved the way the lady at the corner muttered, "Bloody Torchwood." Seems everyone in Cardiff knows what Torchwood does - except poor Rhys! maaboroshi thought maybe the Blowfish was based on some well-known villainous character in the UK - was it?

Are all time agents so versatile?!

Well... I think we've counted up to two out of two. Do all Time Agents take names with the initials JH? Are they all Captains? Do they get to wear outfits from assorted time zones? If so - I approve on all counts!

But there seem to be only seven of them, and disbanded.... So intriguing. (And interesting, just a little like the end of Gallifrey: tragic and dramatic and mysterious. Big things happen, just out of sight.)

I loved Chantho. I'm sorry she died. She'd be great in Torchwood.

[lacesforalady.livejournal.com]

*hides her virgin eyes* I haven't seen it yet!

I was wondering if you would mind being my grammar/plot beta on a bigbang fic that I've signed up to write. It'll be 20,000 words minimum (eek!), so if you don't feel up to a long-term commitment, it's totally cool.

I'm writing a genfic for Supernatural, and hopefully it shouldn't require too much background knowledge to read and enjoy.

*offers cookies*

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen it yet!

I think you will enjoy it.

I don't know that I can find time to beta your story - though if you don't mind if I'm terrifically slow, I'd be happy to do it. Especially as you understand I don't know anything about Supernatural - I do know about grammar.

[abrakadabrah.livejournal.com]

(Was Spike that good on Buffy?)

Well I haven't seen the show yet, just the clips, but why do you think so many of us became such obsessives over at SunnydaleU - particularly those who started watching in Season 6? Brilliant writing, great comic moments, great season arcs and character development and Spike, Spike, Spike!

And why do you think we keep telling *you* that you will love it once you get to it?

It's not like we've been proposing torture or anything....

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

why do you think so many of us became such obsessives over at SunnydaleU

...?

I thought it was the witty multileveled dialogue, the snappy plots, the metatextual insight, the unfolding classical references.

You're telling me it was was Spike all along? That, I can understand!

And I will be starting to watch it very soon now. It is, as they say, in the mail. I'm glad there are a couple of other people now on SunnydaleU who are either watching for the first time, or rewatching. I won't be the only one who's a sort of newbie.

[nina-ds.livejournal.com]

I definitely thought it was a big improvement on last year. It wasn't the best episode in terms of character development or concept or anything, but the whole thing just felt tighter.

Now, as someone who thought Spike was the best thing about Buffy (I really didn't like that show nearly as much as it thought I should!), I was a bit disappointed in John. I'm not sure why. He just didn't "feel" right. I mean, it wasn't bad, but it wasn't "electric" to me, and that's what the script really demanded. But I liked the team development a lot (hey! Ianto showed a glimmer of personality!), and I thought Gwen came off really well, warm and hopeful and competent. Maybe Jack should go away more often!

Here's the weird thing. I thought JB had better sexual chemistry with GM than he did with either of the two guys. ::shakes head::

On a different tack altogether - remember when we talked about doing a watch-through of Due South? Someone else on my f-list wants to do one. D'you want to do it together? We could even make a little community for it, or I'd be happy to host. Maybe an episode a week, dropping in and out, so that it's not too much of a crush?

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

It wasn't the best episode in terms of character development or concept or anything, but the whole thing just felt tighter.

Smoother, tighter writing, I thought.

as someone who thought Spike was the best thing about Buffy

Insofar as I've seen it, I thought so too.

(I really didn't like that show nearly as much as it thought I should!)

Well, I mostly didn't watch it, and wasn't particularly blown away by what I did see - except Spike. I saw mostly bits and pieces of it, not many whole episodes, except of Angel. I watched four episodes or so of Angel because I'd liked Spike, but was generally too bored by it to watch further.

My friends are urging me to watch Buffy properly, and on the faith of my love of Firefly I'm certainly willing to give it a go.

I liked John, and I liked what he revealed or implied of Jack's background. I particularly liked his red jacket. What, shallow, me? Naw, I just have good dress sense.

(hey! Ianto showed a glimmer of personality!)

LOL. I still think Ianto acts like a teen - way too immature for his age - and I don't mean that as a criticism, just my assessment of him. The funny thing is, I usually hate jealousy themes, but I love it here - maybe Ianto just does it well, maybe it's just the way the situation and his reactions fit in the storyline, but I'm really getting a kick out of his difficulty in accepting Jack's other loves, past, present and future (like Captain John and the Doctor). I wonder if we'll be getting Ianto/Jack/Gwen friction at some point.

I thought JB had better sexual chemistry with GM than he did with either of the two guys.

Who is GM? Do you mean Gwen Cooper? I've always thought the Jack/Gwen dynamic was mighty hot and I'd like to see something develop, I think - or at least the heightening of the UST. I certainly don't want to see a monogamous Jack, whoever he's courting.

emember when we talked about doing a watch-through of Due South? Someone else on my f-list wants to do one.

I would like to see the show, and I would certainly like to discuss it as I go. I know rosiespark was interested too, though I don't know if she has the time. Heck, I don't know if I do - but I'm certainly interested. I might be able to manage an episode a day. But I don't have the episodes. (Perhaps I could persuade lmondegreen to lend me some?) It's also not great timing, with Buffy season 1 about to arrive in the mail. But... yes, I'm interested. It sounds like fannish fun.

[raissad.livejournal.com]

This was the best ep. for me since "Small Worlds." I'm very happy.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Me too!

[elebridith]

*cracks knuckles*
Where do I start...? So yeah, season 2 is in my DVD player right now and so far I'm squeeing, shouting with glee and generally am very giddy about it *g*
And I just realized that I probably never commented on the last few eps of season one...? But I have to check my notes at home for those, so I try to start with this one.
First of all: WOHOOO!! *lol*
Re your number
1: No, you are not the only one - I shouted "No, Gwen, stupid!"
2: My first impression really was that it was directed at Ianto mostly. I'm sure he meant it when he said "All of you", but Ianto in the first place. On the other hand, he seemed a little too irritated at the thought of Gwen marrying Rhys - I really can't make sense how he feels about her. Loves her in a way, protective - maybe because she represents a "normal" life as far as it can get, something he can never have? But why would he be jealous then? Hm. I've been spoiled that there will be a Gwen/Rhys wedding later, maybe it becomes clearer then.
5: Oh hell yeah, baby. *g* God, I love this guy. A lot of Spike in it. And the snoggage was of the *flail-faint-thud* variety. Goodness! I've seen the YouTube clip before, but having it almost full-TV-screen... cold shower required.
Loved it how his feelings for Jack always come through - the lip touch after he "killed" him, whoa... pretty intense.
12: Saffron? *lol* Of course! I knew I had heard that trick before!

"Have you seen a blowfish driving a sports car?" Cracked me up. I *so* want to use that line in Real Life some day!
The Star Wars line had me laughing so hard I had to press Pause.
So had the poodle. Gwen's face on that - priceless.
Yup, and Ianto and the stopwatch. *snicker*

Loved it. Furious beginning! I had seen it before *coughs* but it's really so much better on the TV screen, plus I got the dialogue better thanks to subtitles.
More later!

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

So yeah, season 2 is in my DVD player right now

I am envious! Season 2 won't appear here till November, and when it does, I'm not sure I can afford it. But.

so far I'm squeeing, shouting with glee and generally am very giddy about it *g*

And so you should be. It has its flaws - a certain inconsistency, I'd say - but that's okay. It has its moments of brilliance and its hours of glee.

First of all: WOHOOO!!

Seconded!

I don't think the Jack-Gwen-Rhys situation becomes clearer later on. As I interpret it: Gwen loves both Jack and Rhys, but because she wants the life she'll get with Rhys, decides to go for it 100% and ignore her feelings for Jack. Jack wants Gwen, but he's happy with Ianto, and isn't about to complicate either that relationship or hers with Rhys - and he's not unhappy with a loving non-sexual friendship. Rhys knows Gwen cares about Jack but he can accept that as long as she always comes home to him.

Oh hell yeah, baby. *g* God, I love this guy.

Me too. I want more, more, more.

On the other hand - his later appearance confused me. Who is the real Captain John Hart? Stay tuned.

cold shower required.

No complaint from me there. Bring it on.

Loved it how his feelings for Jack always come through - the lip touch after he "killed" him, whoa... pretty intense.

No doubt at all that John loves and wants Jack still.

"Have you seen a blowfish driving a sports car?" Cracked me up. I *so* want to use that line in Real Life some day!

Then I hope you find the opportunity. (Pause for a bit of mind-boggling speculation on the possible circumstances.)

So had the poodle. Gwen's face on that - priceless.

That was so funny. I still chuckle just remembering it.

I look forward to your futher comments!