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I liked today's quote on [livejournal.com profile] 1day1thought:
People often say that 'beauty is in the eye of the beholder,' and I say that the most liberating thing about beauty is realizing that you are the beholder. This empowers us to find beauty in places where others have not dared to look, including inside ourselves. - Salma Hayek
I find that people in our society are very suspicious of beauty, though they look for it everywhere.

I like the idea that beauty is 'liberating', which isn't a way I've thought of it.

But I do know that I like to see it.

Date: 2007-08-15 07:58 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
"Beauty is difficult," Aubrey told Yeats.

But it is essential.

Date: 2007-08-15 08:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Wonderful quote! And so characteristic.

Date: 2007-08-15 08:06 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Yeats was asking him why he drew so many grotesques.

Beauty, in its myriad forms, is my religion. I am, for what it's worth, an out-and-out æsthete.

Date: 2007-08-15 08:08 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I certianly relate to the aesthetes. As a religion? Not exactly. More as a chosen viewpoint. Or maybe through having been influenced by them intellectually at a formative age. Or maybe through a love of art....?

Date: 2007-08-15 08:12 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
All my life I've tried to surround myself with beauty. There was so much material ugliness and mundanity everywhere. The outside world didn't match the world in my head. I try to bring them closer.

Life without art wouldn't be life.

Date: 2007-08-16 01:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I have always found myself surrounded by beauty, I think. Which is not to say there aren't places I've been that I didn't find particularly beautiful in themselves - and in some cases I can intellectually appreciate the beauty but can't access the sense of it either aesthetically or visually. The desert, for example. I am immune to the beauty of the desert, fascinating though the place may be - except for the beauty of the sky over it. Or, microcosmically, the beauty of individual rocks or lizards.

Maybe it depends on the desert. But my taste in landscape runs to more watery places - oceans and forests.

I also like rocky places, like the Mediterranean and the Canadian Shield.

Date: 2007-08-16 02:23 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
For me, there have to be people for there to be beauty. Human habitation, buildings, lives going on or to have gone on.

Date: 2007-08-16 02:47 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I love that too, but it relates to my love of history. Beauty can lie anywhere. In the stars, for example.

Date: 2007-08-16 02:49 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Stars are all right in their way, but I can't enthuse much over them or any other abstract, uninhabited landscape. My universe is very anthropocentric.

Date: 2007-08-16 03:21 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
My interests are anthropocentric. My aesthetics a little less so.

But you may have noticed that I am more likely to be talking about beautiful people than beautiful stars or landscapes, regardless of how much I might love and appreciate a view of the ocean, or the night sky.

Date: 2007-08-16 03:56 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Snurk! Yes!
Beautiful people, beautiful art, beautiful flowers and birds and beasties…
(I saw Tiny Turquoise the Kingfisher again the other day, flitting about over the river!)

Date: 2007-08-16 04:13 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I saw Tiny Turquoise the Kingfisher again the other day, flitting about over the river!

How lovely!

[livejournal.com profile] maasru is babysitting two budgies named Sapphire and Joey. They are much better behaved - i.e., quieter - than my little banshees. I'd like to think this is a sign of how happy my little guys are to express themselves to the fullest.

(Maybe it's just a matter of lung power.)

Date: 2007-08-16 04:19 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Also of temperament. Some budgies are just more extrovert than others!

Date: 2007-08-17 02:06 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
So true - and I have three little guys with overweening ambitions to be major celebrities. Sing! Dance! Preen!

Date: 2007-08-17 05:31 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Do yours get more talking-to/human interaction on a daily basis?

Date: 2007-08-17 11:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Probably not. I'm a really boring human for them: I come home, sit down at my computer, and write. Or, alternately, on a more exciting evening, I come home, flop onto the sofa, and read. I might even sit at my desk if I want to take notes on a book, or do Latin exercises. The excitement of that must be almost too much for them. It isn't that I don't talk to them from time to time, but I'm not the one doing the chattering. They're the ones keeping up whatever dialogue exists.

I guess they figure someone has to keep the place lively, and since I'm not going to do it, they're elected!

Date: 2007-08-15 08:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sollersuk.livejournal.com
As a very intellectual analytic person what I particularly appreciate about beauty is that it is non intellectual and defies analysis: it hits me directly with a physiological impact. Rare, but when I experience it I appreciate it with all my being.

Date: 2007-08-15 08:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Wonderful, isn't it?

Date: 2007-08-16 01:38 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] omnivorously.livejournal.com
And even if we can't break down exactly what causes that delicious, subjective, individual reaction, at least we have fun trying.

Date: 2007-08-16 03:45 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] auriaephiala.livejournal.com
Music affects me that way, as well.

Date: 2007-08-16 12:14 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
I still can't get over the first time I heard a Jaufre Rudel song, some 24 years ago. The fact that it was composed in the 1140s and still sent shivers up my spine.

Date: 2007-08-16 01:33 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Well, beauty is beauty, whether it's visual or auditory.

You are much more musical than I am, but I can feel it in music, too.

Date: 2007-08-16 05:48 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
Beauty exists in almost everything if you train your thought a certain way; definitely in everything that is alive, humans, animals, plants.

Date: 2007-08-16 12:12 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Exactly! (Speaking as the 'mother' of 8 adorable orchids.)
And inanimate objects, too.

Date: 2007-08-16 12:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
I think... that the poetic/philosophical side of it says, some inanimate objects are gorgeous, but some can be ugly; but nothing alive can truly be ugly.

Of course, that's more theory than practice for most people :)

Date: 2007-08-16 01:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
but nothing alive can truly be ugly.

I can't think of any exception to that... though at one end of the spectrum - with certain fish, say, or insects - my appreciation of their beauty becomes entirely philosophical and not visual at all.

Date: 2007-08-16 01:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
I think that a lot of my issues with certain types of insects come not so much from their creepiness as their crawliness - bad experiences in the past that involved insects that can crawl on you and then ouch you. I've been ouched.

When you're ouched by something furry like a cat - also happened to me a lot - you *see* the cat, it doesn't suddenly invade your personal space. Insects have a way of hurting you and being so small you only see them *after* the ouching has been done. And then you associate their look with the damage they can cause. (http://asofterworld.com/index.php?id=75)

Date: 2007-08-16 04:16 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I'm trying to think purely in aesthetic terms. Many of the critters likely to harm or inconvenience me are not the ones I find ugly. Lots of harmless things... from manatees to minnows. Cats (which are beautiful) can harm me just by sitting in the same room, because I'm allergic to them, but I still think they're beautiful. And I love the beauty of many venomous snakes.

Mosquitoes? All bets are off for mosquitoes.

Love your icon.

Date: 2007-08-16 04:21 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Greenfly. Little green bastards.
I just culled some on the Arum Lily.

Date: 2007-08-16 04:33 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
Re icon, thank you, is Good Omens.

Re "purely aesthetic terms", well yes, there's logic and understanding, and then there's "omg this thing has way too many legs take it away take it away". One is in the higher mind, and the other is in the panicky flailing.

I do love snakes. Not sure why. Probably because I was never bitten by one; like I said, past trauma influences the sight.

Date: 2007-08-17 02:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Good omens! Yes, I thought it sounded familiar. No wonder it's good.

I think I'd like the way snakes look even if I had been bitten by one, though I would no doubt hold a grudge.

(You've seen the picture of me with my snake-friend Calvin, I imagine?)

Date: 2007-08-17 03:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
Maybe it's the legs then. Four legs and less = okay, but over four is too much?... *grin*

You've seen the picture of me with my snake-friend Calvin, I imagine?

Can't say that I have, no.

Date: 2007-08-17 05:34 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
Some six-legged creatures are pretty: butterflies, moths, dragonflies, some beetles. I have problems with spiders, but not the big furry ones: because they have fur, they look more like 'proper' solid animals.

Date: 2007-08-17 11:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Funny that I do like butterflies; something to do with their proportions, maybe? The colouring can be good, but it isn't just colour that attracts - there are no fish that I like to look at, and some of them are lovely colours.

I really don't find spiders attractive; which is not to say that they bother me, but I wouldn't look at them much by choice.

Date: 2007-08-17 11:22 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
[I'm reposting this because I screwed up the url. I hate it when I do that.]

Here is a picture, taken at the dawn of time, of me and my friend Calvin (http://www.geocities.com/eugenewrayburn/snake.html). I think he was a python. I thought he was wonderful, but he was surprisingly heavy when his whole body was supported by mine.

I'll remember to count legs on beings I encounter for a while. See if it makes a difference.

Date: 2007-08-18 05:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
Aww, how adorable :) Both of you.

Date: 2007-08-18 12:42 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
It's a nice memory.

Date: 2007-08-16 03:58 pm (UTC)
ext_120533: Deseine's terracotta bust of Max Robespierre (Default)
From: [identity profile] silverwhistle.livejournal.com
but nothing alive can truly be ugly.

I would disagree. Æsthetically, some living things can be quite hideous, and with humans, there's also the dimension of moral ugliness.

Date: 2007-08-16 04:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Moral uginess, indeed. Can we just contrast that to the what-might-have-been, or the what-ought-to-be?

Date: 2007-08-16 04:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sparklebutch.livejournal.com
Aesthetic is in the eye of the beholder, *grin*.

Date: 2007-08-16 01:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Sometimes it's a matter of framing and object with your mind, with your attention.... seeing it as it is, rather than just its function or position in relation to other things.

Date: 2007-08-16 01:34 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
I agree. Even beauty in ugliness, if you don't mind the paradox.

Date: 2007-08-16 05:43 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] fajrdrako.livejournal.com
Yes, so do I. They keep life interesting.

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