Enjoy the Ides of March...

[fajrdrako]

Those who want the Government to regulate matters of the mind and spirit are like men who are so afraid of being murdered that they commit suicide to avoid assassination. - Harry S Truman, 1884 - 1972

I've always liked Truman, one of the few figures of American history whom I know anything much about, thanks to an undergraduate seminar course. His only flaw is/was the difficulty of spelling his name.

The quotation was part of the Quote of the Day list, the theme today being the assassination of Julius Caesar. Caesar is another of my favourite historical figures - smart, effective, and sexier than Truman. Another of the quotes was a rather flip comment by Barbara Tuchmann:

Rome had Caesar, a man of remarkable governing talents, although it must be said that a ruler who arouses opponents to resort to assassination is probably not as smart as he ought to be. - Barbara W. Tuchman, 1912 - 1989

To which I would answer: self-preservation should be a low priority for a statesman; Caesar's successes were largely because he didn't put his safety first. Avoiding risk was not a highly-regarded trait among Romans.

Besides, we should all act according to our best judgement, not according to our fears.

Comments

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Avoiding risk was not a highly-regarded trait among Romans.

Nor among mediæval people. I'm not sure what His Loveliness would make of Tuchman's comment!

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure what His Loveliness would make of Tuchman's comment!

I think he would laugh.

Barbara Tuchman has a nice fluid writing style, but her sense of history is both weak and naive.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

I think he would laugh.

Or make some sort of acerbic comment.
I don't think being stalked and killed by sleeper agents casts any shadows on his intelligence and ability, poor darling.

Barbara Tuchman has a nice fluid writing style, but her sense of history is both weak and naive.

Like a lot of popular history. It's like puréed food: designed to be swallowed easily, with nothing to chew on.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Or make some sort of acerbic comment.

Well deserved.

I don't think being stalked and killed by sleeper agents casts any shadows on his intelligence and ability, poor darling.

And I don't think dying as the result of a conspiracy casts any shadows on Caesar's.

It's like puréed food: designed to be swallowed easily, with nothing to chew on.

With misconceptions and absurdities thrown in.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

With misconceptions and absurdities thrown in.

Yes! The 'dubious additives' of the history world! E-numbers, or something!

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

A little more common sense would have been good.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

Besides, we should all act according to our best judgement, not according to our fears.

That reminds me of Goodkind's Wizards' First Rule:
"People Are Stupid. They will believe anything they want to be true or they fear to be true."

And among the next rules (sixth) is "The only sovereign you can allow to rule you is reason."

But even that should be applied... within reason. I mean, with moderation :)

Just as I believe that no sovereign should be allowed to rule me absolutely.

Ah well. I'm behind on sleep, so forgive me if I'm cryptic. Or slightly pessimistic.

The quotes did amuse me :))

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

"People Are Stupid. They will believe anything they want to be true or they fear to be true."

Woo - that's good!

"The only sovereign you can allow to rule you is reason."

As long as it's your own reasoning, and not someone else's.

I mean, with moderation :)

Easier said than done.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

Easier said than done.

Heh. The big problem with the whole "The path is in the middle way" concept. It is, but... that's not so very easy to uncover. :)

And yeah, Goodkind is good, though I got stuck on the last-but-one book that's out. I dearly love his two lead characters, and a lot of the secondaries (such as Zed. "Nothing is ever easy."-type of old, cranky wizard...)

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Goodkind is definitely on my 'to read' list, but I don't seem to be getting through that list very fast.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

What with DW and TW to watch/rewatch, fanfics to write, fangirl about... and actually communicate?

Me neither.

Meaning, I don't get through my to-read list all that fast either.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I'm reading The Sharing Knife: Legacy currently and to my shame and horror, fell asleep over it last night. At a painfully early hour.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

Ooh! You have it... !

(I am waiting for James' traveling ARC. Only two people before me, and the circle ends with me... if nobody asks for it till then, I might even get a more than the titular 3 days to peruse it, although I haven't dared ask that yet...)

Yesterday I was at work till 11. Afterwards I was so tired I didn't switch my PC on (which is rare). Or open a book (but with the PC off in the morning, I read two chapters of my book - actually rereading Pride and Prejudice - in the morning, instead of just one)

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Ooh! You have it... !

I borrowed it from Alayne. commodorified is waiting for it. I'm trying to get through it fast and I'm failing.

Are you enjoying Pride and Prejudice? I like it, but I always have doubts about Jane Austen: I find her witty, but more distanced from her characters than I like.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

Mm. It'll be probably a couple of weeks at least before I get it. But still, it's getting closer!

I enjoy re-reading Jane Austen, because detached from her characters as she might be (and I'm not denying that), they are such personalities that can both soothe and excite me, depending on what I need. It also makes perfect reading in the morning (as I consider, with good reason, anything before my morning shower as sleepwalking).

Anyhow. Pride and Prejudice is nice, rounded-up. On the last re-read, I found Sense and Sensibility way too wordy - to the point of being distracting at places - but P&P is nice and measured, smooth and delicate.
I'll go to my favourite (Persuasion) next.

When I read your comment, I wondered if it Austen's detachment from her characters that allows such lovely movie adaptations. I mean, it leaves the actors enough room to breathe, and still be true...

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Yes, of the Austen novels, Persuasion is by far my favourite, probably because it contains more emotion. Pride and Prejudice is my second-favourite, and then probably Mansfield Park and Northanger Abbey, with Sense and Sensibility way down the list.

I still haven't read Emma. Yes, it's on my list.

I wondered if it Austen's detachment from her characters that allows such lovely movie adaptations.

Good point. I think that may be true. Such beautiful movies.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Austen just makes me murderous, and I've no time for the film/TV adaptations. Watching paint dry is more exciting.

[kikibug13.livejournal.com]

hahahaha

well, as a matter of fact, when I have time... I like to watch paint dry too. The play of the light is fascinating.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I am delighted to have found someone who likes Austen even less than I do.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

One of the things I found galling about the English Lit curriculum at school was that it operated under the assumption that "all girls love Jane Austen". No. It is bland. Nothing really bad ever happens, and nothing much is at stake.

There were some on-line discussions elsewhere about Austen (due to up-coming TV adaptations), which made me chortle. Someone wrote about her understanding the fear of "poverty" for her heroines... One is presented with the possibility of having to do with one maid-of-all-work if she makes an improvident marriage; others might face being dependent "poor relations", ladies' companions, or at worst (shock! horror!) having to work as governesses.

I'm sure the agricultural labourers and factory-workers (for whom the threat of starvation was still a reality) would have found that a hilarious definition of "poverty".

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I don't think Jane Austen ever talks about labourers and factory-workers, does she? She doesn't (as far as I can recall) ever talk about real social issues - these books are comedies of manners.

I'm not saying she should deal with real social issues, but it shows to me the way her books don't change much in tone and circumstance.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

I don't think Jane Austen ever talks about labourers and factory-workers, does she?

No. The nearest to "poor people" she gets are the Prices – the family of a Marine officer, who's either on half-pay or invalided. But they can afford a servant (albeit a not very efficient one). They were about the only characters I could actually relate to as "real", but the reader was supposed to share Fanny's disdain for them as chaotic and disorganised.

I'm not saying she should deal with real social issues, but it shows to me the way her books don't change much in tone and circumstance.

Yup. It's a twee, decorous little world of tea-parties.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I don't actually like Austen much (except for Persuasion) but she has moments that I like. It's her general tone that bothers me - I often think she doesn't much like her own characters.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Well, given the characters... I wouldn't blame her.
Mind, from what I read about her, she seems to have been a snide bitch. She thought some unfortunate acquaintance's miscarriage was an occasion for a joke - saying she wondered if it had been caused by the woman happening to glance at her (presumably startlingly ugly) husband suddenly. Given the health risks at that time, that does seem a heartless thing to say, even if it was about someone she disliked.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

Mostly I just find that she doesn't put a lot of feeling into her stories - they're clever but not warm.

[dargie.livejournal.com]

Was it Suetonius who called Caesar: "Every woman's man, every man's woman?"

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

It wasn't Suetonius... it was one of Caesar's political enemies, but I can't recall which - Cato, I think. (Oh, to have my reference books with me at work!) The whole phrase was that Caesar was "the husband of every woman and the wife of every man".

Makes me love the man all the more.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Yes: the Classical world is good for canonical slashability.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

And outrageous talk.

[sollersuk.livejournal.com]

One of your favourite historical characters? You disappoint me. One of my projects for when I retire properly (as opposed to 20%) is to write "Julius Caesar and Augustus: Studies in Evil". Starting with ghe genocide element...

When No. 1 daughter was doing A Level Theatre Studies, she did stage designs for "Julius Caesar" drawing on Nazi parallels - copies of The Gallic Wars" in the place of honour tha "Mein Kampf" would have held.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

"Julius Caesar and Augustus: Studies in Evil". Starting with the genocide element...

Go for it! I'm happy to have any number of books about genocidal generals/leaders of the past.

she did stage designs for "Julius Caesar" drawing on Nazi parallels

That reminds me of the episode of The Professionals where they were doing a play with Nazi motifs - but I don't remember what the play was. Must look it up.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Yeah. Can't say I like him much either. Mind, we had to translate some of Gallic Wars at O Level, which I did not find especially entertaining... (Vergil was more fun!) One of the things that annoys me a little is that school-Latin is so in thrall to the Classical age: I would have loved to do some mediæval Latin: I had to discover that for myself in my spare time.

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I agree about the medieval Latin - and we could have done Renaissance Latin, too. Our textbook was all geared to Livy and the Augustan age.

[silverwhistle.livejournal.com]

Cæsar and Vergil at O Level, Tacitus and more Vergil at A Level.
I preferred borrowing the Oxford Book of Mediæval Latin verse from the library, and Helen Waddell's The Wandering Scholars: the Archpoet, and the Carmina Burana...

[fajrdrako.livejournal.com]

I studied Latin with the Ontario high school system, but I didn't actually do it in school, I did it by correspondence. Loved it, and I loved our textbook, which had selections from Caesar, Vergil, Tacitus and many others - including, I was happy to see, Catullus, Ovid and Martial - but relied heavily on Livy for the content on chapters. I liked the history but would have liked a foray into medieval and Renaissance territory. Happily - since I was studying at home I I could read what I like - I picked up a book of the 'Teach Yourself Latin' type - I don't recall the exact title - that relied heavily on Medieval songs and poems and I loved it.