it's entirely possible time passed differently there - that's the only way I can explain why he didn't go utterly insane!
You make it sound kind of like the Phantom Zone. Which works in context, too. Yes, I was wondering how the waking/breathing thing would (or wouldn't) work. Reminded me of a story I once read where an Immortal from Highlander, probably Methos, was kept underwater for a long time. He couldn't die but he couldn't breathe or live, either.
I was actually thinking more along the lines of spiritual exercises for sense deprivation - monks meditating silently in the dark for long periods of time, that sort of thing. Time is relative. Certain spiritual exercises, they say, transcend time. Just another way of looking at it.
Either way, the point is that by embracing the torment, Jack overcame it.
Your explanation of what happened with Captain John makes a lot of sense, and fits what we've seen - at least as far as I remember.
John realised he was in very deep shit and had to reevaluate some things, like how far he would really go and how he did feel about Jack.
There's an idea I like - and I hesitate to call it an implication, because that would mean they meant me to think it, but it's a possibility - that John kicked the drug'n'murder habit after "Kiss, Kiss, Bang, Bang" when he saw how Jack had grown and how he had a good life and was reminded how much he loved him. Making Jack the inspiration for the changes in John, parallel perhaps to the machinations of Grey trying to manipulate John to harm Jack.
I think he probably still doesn't want him around but I think he is grateful and likely trusts him a little more - just not enough to want him to stay.
Maybe Jack thinks that John is finding his own path and will come back when he's ready. Maybe he thinks Torchwood (meaning Gwen and Ianto) aren't ready for John. For various reasons I'm sure it'd be awkward for him to have Ianto and his ex both on the premises together - though it might be fun to see. But as it stands, John is problematic for him, and I think it's a mark of trust at least that he thinks the problem of John can be shelved for a bit while he sorts out other things.
They've definitely left it open for a return though, and that is cool.
I would dance in joy if I could.
All I have to say about Toshiko and Owen is that I cried my eyes out and between them Naoko and Burn broke my heart.
Their acting was wonderful. Good dialogue, too. I had wondered if they would kill both but I didn't really expect it. I thought maybe Toshiko would die and Owen would become alive again. But... no.
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timeasmymeasure
part 2
Date: 2008-04-06 09:29 pm (UTC)You make it sound kind of like the Phantom Zone. Which works in context, too. Yes, I was wondering how the waking/breathing thing would (or wouldn't) work. Reminded me of a story I once read where an Immortal from Highlander, probably Methos, was kept underwater for a long time. He couldn't die but he couldn't breathe or live, either.
I was actually thinking more along the lines of spiritual exercises for sense deprivation - monks meditating silently in the dark for long periods of time, that sort of thing. Time is relative. Certain spiritual exercises, they say, transcend time. Just another way of looking at it.
Either way, the point is that by embracing the torment, Jack overcame it.
Your explanation of what happened with Captain John makes a lot of sense, and fits what we've seen - at least as far as I remember.
John realised he was in very deep shit and had to reevaluate some things, like how far he would really go and how he did feel about Jack.
There's an idea I like - and I hesitate to call it an implication, because that would mean they meant me to think it, but it's a possibility - that John kicked the drug'n'murder habit after "Kiss, Kiss, Bang, Bang" when he saw how Jack had grown and how he had a good life and was reminded how much he loved him. Making Jack the inspiration for the changes in John, parallel perhaps to the machinations of Grey trying to manipulate John to harm Jack.
I think he probably still doesn't want him around but I think he is grateful and likely trusts him a little more - just not enough to want him to stay.
Maybe Jack thinks that John is finding his own path and will come back when he's ready. Maybe he thinks Torchwood (meaning Gwen and Ianto) aren't ready for John. For various reasons I'm sure it'd be awkward for him to have Ianto and his ex both on the premises together - though it might be fun to see. But as it stands, John is problematic for him, and I think it's a mark of trust at least that he thinks the problem of John can be shelved for a bit while he sorts out other things.
They've definitely left it open for a return though, and that is cool.
I would dance in joy if I could.
All I have to say about Toshiko and Owen is that I cried my eyes out and between them Naoko and Burn broke my heart.
Their acting was wonderful. Good dialogue, too. I had wondered if they would kill both but I didn't really expect it. I thought maybe Toshiko would die and Owen would become alive again. But... no.